SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I’m going to give you the benefit of my experience with a cheating spouse.

Just a bit of background. My H had a 4 year in person EA that he refused to admit to. I knew it was going on. Finally ended. Rugswept 100%.

Years later it’s now a typical midlife crisis affair. He’s kicking me to the curb after 25 years of Marriage to be with the OW.

My smartest move was choosing an amazing counselor during this nightmare.

My worst move was doing the pick me dance. I didn’t know about SI during the affair so I made some typical mistakes.

It took me 6 months of being on an emotional rollercoaster and dday2 to finally stand up to my H. During the 6 months between dday1 and dday2, I was smart enough to get a plan B together.

Long story short — when I found out he was still cheating — I had a very calm rational 1 minute conversation. My exact words were this: I am divorcing you. I’m sorry it has come to this but you have left me with no other choice. This marriage is over and you are free to be with the OW or anyone else you choose.

I left the room. I did not give him an opportunity to speak.

He then starts begging me to R. Dday2 when I found out he was cheating he had (for the millionth time) demanded a D. Of course I was shocked and blindsided because a few days before he was all in on reconciling.

I said no to R. I then told him he had to leave.

He still thought he was in control.

I told him I was filing for D after the holiday season. New year. Fresh start. I had the mediators lined up and ready to go. I had a plan and was executing it.

He was stunned. Never expected it. Thought he could sweet talk his way out of the mess.

He saw a side of me he never expected. I did the hard 180 and did everything to protect myself.

In short I saw signs of potential and held off on filing for D. It was on a day by day basis initially. I required a post nup to even consider reconciling w/ him. And for the first year of R it was very difficult.

We are one of the lucky ones who have happily reconciled. But only because my H changed.

Welcome to SI, Glad you found us but sorry you had to. What she is doing is trying to control things through manipulation. She isn't controlling things going forward. You need to go hard 180, be willing to lose the M, the outcome isn't clear at this point but the direction for you is getting you and your kids out of infidelity hell. Some of the advice will seem counter productive but if you take back control over your life and family, she will be outside looking in.

We are one of the lucky ones who have happily reconciled. But only because my H changed.

Wow, The1stWife, thank you so much for sharing your story. I'm so glad you guys are still together.

Some of the advice will seem counter productive but if you take back control over your life and family, she will be outside looking in.

I appreciate the kind words from everyone.

Although I do regret doing the pick-me-dance (heck I even read about it early on and STILL did it). Like you all know, when you have young kids and actually still do love your wife, it feels like the ONLY thing you can do at the time.

Anyway, I think waiting has only emboldened her belief that I'm the problem and her affair was justified. On the other hand, I think she was so infatuated early on that she would have gladly had me walk out as soon as possible so she could get on with her fantasy life.

Seriously, before this happened I could have never told you what an emotional affair was. Now I can't believe how powerful it is. It's like I'm living with a totally different person.

Although I do regret doing the pick-me-dance (heck I even read about it early on and STILL did it). Like you all know, when you have young kids and actually still do love your wife, it feels like the ONLY thing you can do at the time.

I get it I did everything to "save" our M. I danced for months and it only got worse. It wasn’t until I let her go, and went 180 that reality hit her. I was done and headed for D, I was taking control of my life and family, she was free to go. She begged for R and followed every requirement.

She wasn’t perfect, but she was very committed to a successful R. I am thankful, because 3 years later, our Minor Son was hospitalized for nearly a year, She was by his side the entire time. Staying at a hotel hours away from home while I continued working and caring for his twin. I would visit on the weekends. I didn’t have any triggers or gut feelings about the distance, she had built "trust" back and together we made a great team for his care.

Your wife maintaining contact with the AP is a serious problem. It fuels the fantasy. Your wife needs a dose of reality. Be calm, factual, and businesslike. Demand no contact. Lawyer up. Find dirt on the AP that would help to de-idealize him. Maintaining secrecy might not be to your advantage as it helps your wife avoid real life consequences. Work on yourself to be strong and calm. Document/journal your discussions with her; the AP might be recommending the same to her, in fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if she attempts to pick a fight with in the attempt to record bad behavior.

I get it I did everything to "save" our M. I danced for months and it only got worse. It wasn’t until I let her go, and went 180 that reality hit her. I was done and headed for D, I was taking control of my life and family, she was free to go. She begged for R and followed every requirement.

Thanks very much for the insight. Do you mind if I ask- how did you leave the door open while indicating you were done?

-Still waiting until I meet with a laywer- but that is the point I'm at now.

I guess I'm asking, was it just a conversation?... had you already met with a lawyer?

I'm using so much from this thread to draft my "talk" when the time comes. Had some excellent examples before and you don't have to provide what you said. But I'm curious about the setting that finally made her "wake up".

Biggest mistake I've made so far is early on (while doing the pick me dance) I basically acknowledged I had been depressed and neglected her- AKA given her a reason to look elsewhere. At the time I wrongly assumed some grace and humility might cause her to be remorseful. Of course I know now that it was 100% her choice to cheat regardless of how she felt about us. I think it also made her feel like she was justified and she dug her heals in. So when the time comes for the talk I'm going to have to walk it back- THIS WAS YOUR CHOICE.

Document/journal your discussions with her; the AP might be recommending the same to her, in fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if she attempts to pick a fight with in the attempt to record bad behavior.

Excellent advice. I have been keeping a daily log and watching my every move.

Side note- Anyone had experience with "Marriage Helper" or any of those other paid "save your marriage" services?

Thanks very much for the insight. Do you mind if I ask- how did you leave the door open while indicating you were done?

-Still waiting until I meet with a laywer- but that is the point I'm at now.

I guess I'm asking, was it just a conversation?... had you already met with a lawyer?

I can't speak for Tanner, of course, but I can answer some of your questions from my perspective. I did the pick me dance for almost a month until I hit my limits. I started calling lawyers. A couple of them, and I started setting up appointments for consults. After that I started calling real estate agents to see what we would need to start doing to put the house up for sale, all right in front of her. Then I hung up and started talking logistics with her. "Are we selling the house, or are you going to buy me out of my half? If you stay here, that's what's going to have to happen, and If you do stay, then you can keep the dogs. Otherwise we're going to have to figure out what we're doing with them."

It took a few minutes, but when she realized I was serious-serious, that I wasn't going to live in infidelity one minute longer, and the crushing finality of it all hit, she completely crumbled, broke down sobbing and begged me to not go through with it. She saw thafi wasn't bluffing or playing around, and I wasn't. I gave it a couple of days to see if she was going to walk any of it back. She didn't. So then I called and canceled the appointments. She sent a no contact message, blocked him on everything everything, and put in for a location transfer at work. She has not once looked back or attempted to contact him again, and she has been completely consistent from that time forward, almost exactly a year ago. There was a complete 180 in her attitude.

That was my approach. Some might consider it a little bit too "bull in a China shop" and it might not work for everyone, but it was very effective in my case. It really snapped my wife out of it. A couple of caveats, tho. She had never considered leaving the marriage, and is still very much in love and attracted to me. She's managed to convince me of that over the last year, and she's not a typical remorseless WS, so bear that in mind also.

Biggest mistake I've made so far is early on (while doing the pick me dance) I basically acknowledged I had been depressed and neglected her- AKA given her a reason to look elsewhere. At the time I wrongly assumed some grace and humility might cause her to be remorseful. Of course I know now that it was 100% her choice to cheat regardless of how she felt about us. I think it also made her feel like she was justified and she dug her heals in. So when the time comes for the talk I'm going to have to walk it back- THIS WAS YOUR CHOICE.

You don't necessarily have to walk anything back. If the facts you acknowledged are true, they're true. However, none of what had been going on in your marriage, even if you could be faulted for some of it, justified her having an affair. Nothing justifies that choice. I absolutely contributed to some issues we had in my marriage, and I own that, but those are completely separate from her choice to cheat on me. I admitted my faults and am working on my shit, but none of it justified her affair, and after I made that realization I made it CRYSTAL CLEAR I was not going to accept any blame for her choices.

There were a hundred different things she could have done that didn't involve lying, deception, sneaking around, gaslighting, and cheating. She could have communicated her needs better, requested counseling, hell, even start divorce proceedings if it was that bad for her, but no marital issue or problem is EVER solved by bringing a third party into the relationship. That decision is on her, and her alone. So yeah, you don't have to really walk anything back, unless you accepted any blame for her choices that is, but the most egregious wound right now, by far, is her infidelity. You can still acknowledge your contributions to any marital problems, but all of that takes a back seat until the infidelity issue - the choices she made, is resolved and she takes full accountability for it.

Side note- Anyone had experience with "Marriage Helper" or any of those other paid "save your marriage" services?

I have watched quite a bit of, specifically, Marriage Helper content. They have some good advice and have helped a lot of couples, but I think their approach is a little bit too "save the marriage at almost any cost," and sometimes advise a BS eat a few too many shit sandwiches for my taste. I've seen them suggest basically "just hang in there" while the WS continues the affair and patiently wait for it to fizzle out or they decide to come around. Like, a year or more in some cases. Huh-uh. Nope. That comes across a little too much like playing the pick me game. The advice I got here was much better in my case. Marriage Helper is very pro-reconciliation. I think almost to a fault.

I think "Wes White Counseling" on YouTube has better advice and approaches. He seems to really get it from the BS point of view.

[This message edited by Pogre at 12:02 AM, Wednesday, May 20th]

deepseacalm, I think you're immediate goal should be to extricate yourself from this situation as quickly and decisively as possible. There's no need, IMO, to have a "talk," no need to explain yourself. Nothing you say is going to make any difference at all. You know, actions speak louder than words.

Meet with this lawyer and then file the paperwork. When she sees your petition for divorce, the reality of her situation will become crystal fucking clear.

(In most states there's a mandatory waiting period. You can withdraw the petition at any time, right up to the actual court date.)

She might pull a sudden 180 and beg for a second chance - or she might sign the petition right then and there. Whatever happens, the most important thing is finding your way out of infidelity.

If she does want to save the marriage, then you can lay out the terms and conditions. But that's for another day.